Pointer

Jul. 31st, 2007 04:17 pm
kyanited: (sae movie)
[personal profile] kyanited
I'm sure some of you have read it, I'm also sure some haven't, and some most likely have seen the film.

Erica's review of the 1994 Takarazuka documentary Dream Girls

"Secondly, it's important to remember that Takarazuka was NOT designed to create strong, independent women - its was created to create "good wives, wise mothers." These women are not graduating to positions of financial and personal independence; they are expected to marry and subordinate themselves fully to their husbands-"



I'm quite happy times are a bit different now. *pets movie-star Saeko*


ETA: *also pets movie star Dan-chan*

(no subject)

Date: 2007-07-31 02:57 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] shanejayell.livejournal.com
Cool...

Also, thanks for the friend.
:)

Why, hello there!

Date: 2007-07-31 03:14 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] kyanited.livejournal.com
np, I only now noticed you had friended me. >_<

(no subject)

Date: 2007-07-31 03:27 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] jenebi.livejournal.com
I think I've seen this person's blog before. For someone who writes about Takarazuka, she doesn't seem to like it much...

It also seems from some of the things she says that she doesn't really know much about Takarazuka... of course, Dreamgirls itself is full of misconceptions. Though it did get some of the performers to talk about things they wouldn't have otherwise. Like having a boyfriend. ;)

(no subject)

Date: 2007-07-31 04:35 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] kyanited.livejournal.com
Oh, she does have a weak spot for certain performers...

Erica likes Ayaki Nao as Der Tod.

And she likes Touko :P

"But at some point Aran Kei stepped out on the stage as Fersen and my interest in Takarazuka was born. And despite my refusal to obsess, I do still like Aran Kei. :-)" (source (http://okazu.blogspot.com/search?q=aran+kei))

But in general I think she doesn't care much about zuka, she's posted almost daily for years now and there are only 4 zuka-related posts.


>> of course, Dreamgirls itself is full of misconceptions.

<sigh> I do like being told some background, but after reading some reviews and opinions on the Roberts book (published around the same time, I think), I'm sure I'll need some 'real' insider's guidance on how to take these works 'by westerners for westerners'...

"Intriguingly, the way most Westerners interpret the Takarazuka Revue, [...] - is often the complete opposite of that of many Japanese." (Some aticle I read a while ago. (http://metropolis.co.jp/tokyotravel/tokyojapantravel/368/tokyojapantravelinc.htm))

(no subject)

Date: 2007-07-31 07:40 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sumire-no-hana.livejournal.com
There are few western writings out there about Takarazuka that it's difficult for people not to fall back on the standard recommendations. Part of the problem is that most of these are western views on a product of a non-western culture. (Though the revue is heavily influenced by western culture, it's obviously Japanized and lays in the context of a culture outside of our own with fans who are steeped in that same culture and its mores)

Yes... my only advice is to take Roberts's book with a very large grain of salt. -_- I have this horrible tendancy to bite my lip and stop myself from saying anything whenever people recommend it - I even hesitate to say that it's a good introduction to Takarazuka. It's so heavy on it's own agenda that things are quite obviously skewed.

I've never actually seen the Dream Girls documentary, so can't provide any information there.

The best I've come across, thusfar, is Stickland's thesis and offers a much more complex and learned view than Roberts's book

(sorry this is so long!)

(no subject)

Date: 2007-07-31 07:41 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sumire-no-hana.livejournal.com
And I'm sure all of this is old news to you, so just ignore all this if I've rambled too much ^^;

(no subject)

Date: 2007-07-31 08:06 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] kyanited.livejournal.com
XD Well, yes, I downloaded this thesis a while ago (haven't read it all yet).

I think someone's comment on the Robertson book was that even if the text is debatable, the pictures are pretty. :D Yay zuka.

Part of the problem is that most of these are western views on a product of a non-western culture. (Though the revue is heavily influenced by western culture, it's obviously Japanized and lays in the context of a culture outside of our own with fans who are steeped in that same culture and its mores)

Thank you for phrasing my thoughts so concisely. :P

(no subject)

Date: 2007-07-31 09:28 pm (UTC)
ext_8692: (Default)
From: [identity profile] ladybretagne.livejournal.com
You make an excellent point. The thing that strikes me particularly is that so many Westerners who decry or at least criticize the gender roles and perceived misogyny of the revue seem to be doing it from such a stance of Western dominance. Honestly, there is still such /rampant/ sexism at work in American culture that the undercurrent of "oh wouldn't they be better off somewhere else or doing something else" just strikes me as short sighted and, as you said, taking what is being studied out of the necessary cultural context. Cultural relativism is an important thing that seems to be missing from a lot of what is available in terms of academic or at least semi-academic discussion of the revue.

(no subject)

Date: 2007-08-01 01:47 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] muffin-song.livejournal.com
I think a lot of people fall into this trap. What annoys me the most is when people start generalizing that ALL Japanese women are like this. While it's a generalization that is based in some truth, it annoys me because it completely leaves out the women who work at my school who put in just as many hours as the guys. And some of the other more high powered women I know.

Japan's gender relations aren't perfect, but I think sometimes when talking about gender relations in Japan people start idealizing women's role western society too much. Cause the western world definitely still has problems too.

(no subject)

Date: 2007-08-01 03:35 am (UTC)
ext_8692: (Default)
From: [identity profile] ladybretagne.livejournal.com
It's no more accurate to say that all Japanese women are the shy retiring wallflowers that stereotypes make them out to be than it is to say that all Californian women are health-nut beach bunnies or wannabe actresses. Globally gender equality is a problem and it's so ridiculously arrogant of Westerners to look down upon what they perceive as issues in other cultures without turning that same critical eye to the things that Western media perpetrates on the psyches of women.

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